Oh, 7 Ep 1 - Juno (what I'm saying)

Juno was the indie darling of 2007, earning critical acclaim and commercial success. We break down what made it great, how it holds up and what makes in painful in 2025.

Links and references

Youtube essay: Juno: The subtle art of misdirection - DaveScripted

Podcast episode: In the bedroom with Elliot Page - The Pink House with Sam Smith

Transcript

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Hello everyone. Welcome to the '07 podcast. A podcast exclusively about the films of 2007. Everything from Shrek 3 to Die Hard 4 to Transformers 1 to Norbit to Epic Movie to Daddy Daycare. All the absolute classics and some that have won awards and stuff. Have you got anything to add there, Lucy? Well, after that exhaustive list, I I can't think of any. No. Uh, obviously we got all the the extra classics from 2007 like No Country for Old Men, There Will Be Blood, Juno, Zodiac, Pepilolis. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Uh, I was I actually was thinking Pan's Labyrinth, you know, because I thought it's a cusp film. I was looking this up as well and I've included it in our graphics. I stupidly didn't check properly and I put it in there and then I saw some people say it's a 2006 film. Some people site it as 2007. So I think it is going to be one of those cusp films that we do and that's fine. It's an amazing film. We should cover it. Um but I've left it in the graphics just for some people to point it out to me and be all pedantic about it. But let's talk about why we're doing 2007 anyway. 2007 for me was a time when I was working for the BBC. I was running a website about movies for the BBC. It was called BBC Movies. It occurred to me later in life that wow, there was a really good time to work in films. You know, we've just listed all those amazing films that came out in 2007 and one arguably from 2006, an asterisk. Um, but Lucy, you've got some connection to 2007. Why don't you tell us about it? Yeah. So 2007 was the year that I went to university and I went to the University of Warick to study film and television. So I was deep in the thick of watching films um as much as I could get my uh hands on, eyes on. Um so in amongst of course watching all of the different films and TV programs I had to watch for my course, I was then going to the cinema uh talking about films, reading about films. It was just I was just super on it at the time. Um, and I felt very uh blessed because there were so many great films that year. I don't think I obviously was aware of it at the time of being of it being like a standout year, but I can look back now um and see it as like I'm going to go there. Tay, a golden year for film. It's going to be interesting because I think we've done a couple of these now, but this will be the first one. Um, and I think this one will be revealing because it is tricky to separate the me of 2007 from me of 2025 other than the obvious thing which is that I'm very old now. Um, and have become much more reactionary. Um, and so you almost have to analyze two versions of yourself and their interpretations of this film. I've got to say I saw this film in 2007. I really really liked it. I saw this film in 2025. I still liked it although there were bits of it that really irritated me. We'll get into it. Tell me your first impressions of Juno. Yeah, I think whilst I don't think I found it as divisive as you, I did look back at it this time thinking, "Oh, wow." Like I I'm not viewing it in the same way as I did then. Um it felt like something cool and new and quirky and different and fun. And I think particularly some of the the styling and the way that Juno speaks, I think we've seen it so many times since then. So I think it's like become a bit tired. But of course then it was quite fresh. Um but I still I still enjoyed it. I have to say though there are things that I watch now like you say with a 2025 lens and made me feel really like uncomfortable. Um which I don't think I felt at the time. I don't think I I don't think particularly of course the the Mark and Juno liaison. Oh my god. Spoilers already. Yeah. I don't I just don't think I reacted as viscerally as I did this time around. Oh, that's interesting. Yeah, which is Yeah, maybe I've like grow for sure have grown up, but like I've grown up. Yeah, you're growing right now. I hope not. I meant like emotionally. Oh, you meant emotionally. sorry over time. Um, yeah, that and that is something that's going to come up. I think something that I picked up on more this time around is there's a real disconnect between the maturity of how everybody speaks. Not just Juno, you kind of mentioned Juno there, but like even even Rain Wilson in the shop in the local shop, they they all talk with this that I think at the time I probably thought was really fun. Whereas now in a post Marvel Joss Weeden world, it just needles me just ever so slightly. There you go. I've become grumpy old man. Yeah, you definitely have. Whereas I'm clearly still idealistic. Yeah. Let's get into it. Let's get into like the bits that irritated you and we can argue about the things we want to argue about. Yeah. Okay. So, Juno is a 2007 indie comedy uh directed by Jason Wrightman, son of Ivan Wrightman. And it wasn't the first big Elliot Page film, but it was, I think, the one with the most impact and the one with the most acclaim. And there's a really great supporting cast. And essentially, it's about the titular character, Juno, uh, played by Ell Paige, who is a 16-year-old who gets pregnant. Would you call it a coming of age film, Lucy? Yeah, definitely. Um, I think what we should also point out whilst we're talking about Juno, um, as you've raised, uh, the the lead character there and the lead actor, Elliot Paige played Juno, who is a young woman. Um, Elliot transitioned uh, in I think 2019, 2020, something like around that time. So, we will talk about Elliot with he him pronouns, but when we talk about Juno, the character, we'll use she her pronouns because that was the that's the character. Um, and there's whole there's a whole thing to talk about there around coming of age as you said about uh it being um a queer film uh queercoded. Oh, yeah. like watching it with 2025 eyes, knowing about Elliot's life and transition, um, and seeing the way that Juno was personified and created, even down to physicality, what she's wearing, etc. It's kind of it's all there. Um, and yeah, so for listeners, if it gets confusing, that that's that's what how we're talking about them. I don't think it's going to get confusing. Um, I think it'll be fine. Yeah, Juno essentially gets pregnant and then goes through a roller coaster ride of initially considering abortion and then changing her mind and eventually arranging an adoption for when she has this baby. Podcast noise. Hello there listener. It's Taye here. Just a quick programming note and a bit of a heads up that next episode we're going to be talking about Danny Bole's 2007 film Sunshine. So, if you haven't seen it, go and watch it because we're going to spoil the ever loving crap out of it. And I know that sounds like homework, but I'd rather say that up front uh rather than spoil the film for you. So, check it out. You won't be sorry. Uh Lucy, did you spot the Hard Candy reference? No. Hard Candy is a very disturbing film starring Elliot Paige, and he is amazing in it. Uh it plays obviously a young girl, a youngish girl, teenager uh who is prayed upon by a pedophile. The character entraps that pedophile and then does messed up stuff to him. And the hard candy iconography was all around sort of Little Red Riding Hood. There's an iconic kind of red hoodie that the character wears. And very early on in this film, like the second or third scene, you see a shot of Juno walking through like a crowd of joggers who are kind of running the other way wearing just hood up wearing this red hoodie. And I thought that is so sort of similar to the look of Hard Candy that it has to be a little nod. So um I'm going to claim it as uh as that. So yeah, we are introduced to Juno. She is running to the coolest corner shop in the world staffed by the coolest uh corner shop worker Rain played by Rain Wilson. He's there with his his classic lines like your ego is prego and the other one where she's been taking loads of pregnancy tests so she's been peeing a lot and she shakes one and he says that ain't no Etch a sketch. This is one doodle that can't be undid home slice. Which is uh how everybody speaks. It's just great. It's just great. He's just basically Dwight, isn't he? Just with a bit more bit more energy. Yeah. Um, and I love the little cameo. And that actually kind of brings me on to like thinking about, you talking about the the amazing cast around Elliot Page. Uh, is it JK Simmons? Is that his last name? Um, he apparently after reading the script would have taken any part in the film, even the non-speaking part of the teacher that her friend fancies because he loved it so much. Um, and so I feel like that probably was the same for for Rain in that he literally was in the first scene, that was it. Um, he had, you know, three, four lines, that was it. Um, but it but it sets the tone, doesn't it, for the rest of the film in terms of that kind of clipped, witty, sarcastic, quite unnatural way of speaking that uh kind of litters litters the rest of the film because it's not just he and Juno that speak like that. Even like her parents speak like that. Um, yeah, it it it's great. It's more Juno and her friend, uh, Leah, played by Olivia Thelby, there's like they're like super kind of, you know, snappy and everyone else, it's more that they're used to Juno talking that way and so they are very tolerant and I think they're impressed by her intellect, but she's like leading the way in the kind of snappy dialogue stakes. I feel we're dripfed the uh the supportive family. Everyone is supportive in this film pretty much. Um so you've got Leah uh Juno's friend. You have uh Michael Sarah who plays Paulie Bleecker. You assume that they are kind of boyfriend girlfriend but it seems like no. Juno tells uh Paulie about her pregnancy and he's you know a bit dumbruck. Doesn't really know what to do about it. I feel like she's sort of testing him in that scene. Um it does feel like in several scenes she's kind of testing him a little bit. Um but he is, you know, broadly supportive. I think he would just do whatever she said. That's something that we should talk about is how it's kind of set maybe in the '9s, in the naughties, but you never see any technology. Well, you know, the the only thing that kind of points to where and when it is is probably like the car that she drives, which is already old and beaten up, but there's like no mobile phones. You never see any like laptops or computers really. Not that I can remember. Have you been reading my notes? No, I haven't. Um, but it it it lends itself to that kind of indie nostalgia, that kind of look back at 80s ' 90s vibes. Um, also fun fact, the burger phone that she used um was super influential uh in that like apparently like sales of like burger phones like shot up after Juno and the film company sent burger phones to review it like critics to review the film. Anyway, I was talking about the family home setup. It's quite small. It's crammed. It's very retro inside. Doesn't look like it's been decorated since I don't know like the 70s or 80s. Um but it's like fun. It's warmly lit. Um, lots of yellows and browns and reds and it looks really gorgeous and cozy and it's a blended well, it's not really a blended family, is it? It's dad, stepmom, and then dad and stepmom's daughter. So, they're half sisters. Uh, and it's it just looks really fun and warm and welcoming. Um, but it doesn't look like they've got much money. No, definitely workingass. Yeah. Yeah. She like um Allison Johnny's character Brenda, she's a um nail technician and the dad's like an engineer or something. Yeah. He fixes um uh like air conditioning. That's it. So yeah, like you say, working-class family like um lots of love but don't have loads of money to spare on anything lavish. Um, but it's that kind of supportive co really cozy space that surrounds Juno and that's her world. Yeah, it's really lovely and like you say, it's a really good kind of canvas to paint these characters onto and then kind of contrast that to the family that we meet later on. But before we do that, Juno organizes to have an abortion. She goes to a clinic and then she has a change of heart. So, she decides she's going to have this baby and find some adoptive parents. And Leah, her friend, suggests looking in the local newspaper uh because they advertise in the local newspaper. And they find uh the couple that we end up meeting. And this is the point where she thinks, "Okay, well, I have to tell my family about the fact that I'm pregnant." And that scene is just really well handled. She's like uncharacteristically nervous, it seems. I thought she would just quip her way through this, but she seems kind of like pained. And um she tells her stepmom and her dad. It's a sort of comedic moment for them. They when they ask who the father is, and she tells them, they're like in disbelief that this this little this this little guy was capable of that. And it's really funny and indicative of their tolerance, I would say, of their daughter. There's also a really great line. The dad, Max, says,"I didn't think that you were that kind of girl." And um Elliot Paige's uh response, he says, "I don't really know what kind of girl I am." Which is um interesting. Like if you go back and read some of the kind of accounts of uh then Ellen Page, now Elliot Page at the time, um he was definitely going through some stuff. I think definitely had realized that he was queer and uh didn't feel 100% comfortable with, you know, his gender. Um, and uh, there's loads of stories about having to promote this film, having to wear dresses and kind of present, uh, which I think really left a mark on him. I think in 2025 that line does carry a little extra bit of weight. I think you also could have seen it back in the day as a kind of well, no one really knows what kind of person they are as a teenager. You know, everyone's figuring things out. And, you know, I don't I honestly don't think it would have even registered in 2007, but obviously, like you say, watching it back now, knowing where Elliot was at the time, where he is now, it's unavoidable. Um and whilst I was doing my research, I was reading about Elliot and reading about um you know his film um back catalog and his life through film etc. And something that he said was actually so much of um Juno was dictated by him. So the clothes that she wore, the way that she walked, um the way that she was not girly girly, you know, y um and like you say, he then found it really hard to then be made to be wearing frocks and dresses and all of that kind of stuff on the on the red carpet. Um and it's and it's almost like that queerness, that queercoded exploration was taken away from him. I think it adds an extra layer of context now that Junior has told her family about the adoption plan. Uh it's time to meet the adopted parents and all of that setting up of how how where she lives and how she lives is contrasted beautifully with this kind of like this area where all these houses are kind of quite sort of pristine in a in a kind of new American sense. Um you know kind of characterless. So, their journey to the house is intercut with just shots of off camera Jennifer Garner um straightening things which um I think is really lovely and a nice kind of it's such an obvious nod to the sort of background um and homestead of Juno and her family as they're driving. I think it's deliberately played for laughs where every house basically looks the same. So, it's just um like jump cuts to each house and they are sort of variations on the same and they are so different from the kind of hickledy pickledy mishmashy mess of uh Juno's home. And like you say, it's setting up this quite sort of pristine, not clinical, but pristine world that Mark and Vanessa live in. Um but it sets it up so that Juno bursts in. She's just bursting into their lives in the most endearing way and just like she's just suddenly there and she seems to sort of always be there. So, we meet uh Vanessa played by Jennifer Garner, her husband Mark played by Jason Baitman. I forget the name of the uh the lawyer that they have present. Um but she has a German name. She has a German character. It's so disrespectful. Like I would so if I was a German with a very German sounding name and um a young 16-year-old just said my name in a German accent, I'd be so offended. Um but it is it is a funny moment. You got this lovely um contrast between Juno just acting like she's lived there her whole life and just owns the place and JK Simmons character, the dad, just kind of like being slightly embarrassed by his daughter and probably like just quietly impressed by how sassy she is as well. We quickly learn how very much Vanessa wants to have had a kid by now. And um the portrayal of her by Ghana is so good. Um and you get a sense that it's a bit like Michael Sarah's character in relation to Juno. You get a sense that the Jason Baitman character Mark is kind of hovering around just doing doing stuff. Yeah. I'm glad you brought that up. So when Juno says to him, "Are you looking forward to becoming a dad?" And he's like, "Yeah, yeah, you betcha. I want to do all those things that dads do. And I was like, it's obvious right from that point. And you said, you're watching that with your 2025 eyes. And I said, absolutely no way. I knew it from when I watched it the first time around. It it becomes apparent as we get through the film. What a dork Mark is. Um, but initially, I think I was uh I was tricked. I was tricked by Mark and his kind of seeming sort of bland neness. Um, I think it's overshadowed by how good Ghana is in this scene, how very much more present she is. I think you come away from this scene feeling like she really does want to have a baby. And um, he, you know, pales in comparison to to that. But, uh, it's a great introduction to these characters, especially Ghana. I'm going to say a lot of glowing frothy stuff about Ghana, I'm afraid. When I watched this back recently and I had problems with it, she was the bit that kind of shone through. Yeah, she did a great job. Uh I was reading that she actually took like a pay cut um to do the role because it's an indie film, but then of course obviously the film did really well. Um she did very well out of it. Uh but obviously she was one of the big names. She was kind of the darling at the time, wasn't she? Um she does she does a really good job of playing that role. um that kind of neurotic perfect high achiever which is a complete foil to Mark's kind of wannabe rock star wearing like a long sleeve top underneath his short sleeve top. Yeah, as I was saying, I I clocked it early doors that they weren't right for each other. And then that quickly is made evident throughout the rest of the scenes that we see them either together or we see Mark with Juno. Um, and they seem weirdly like more of a match because Juno is obviously quite mature for her age and he is quite immature for his age. still sort of stuck in playing, you know, with his guitars like kind of in his garage, but one up from that in the room that Vanessa has given him. Um, which Juno actually remarks on and kind of makes fun of him for. But you had a you made a good point about um like her being into punk and him being into grunge. Yeah. So you get your first kind of whiff of something not being quite right when Junah goes upstairs to use a bathroom and then he's kind of comes to check up on her and then she spots his guitar and they have the first of these kind of generational chats about their references and you know he's a sort of ' 900s grunge kid and she is into the ' 70s and sort of late '7s punk era and that's fine but um I found that stuff a little bit painful to watch just two people of different generations just comparing things. God, it just drives me insane that [ __ ] I can't stand it. Imagine a podcast that did that. I I would not listen to that podcast. What a piece of [ __ ] Uh so yeah, they have a little impromptu jam session. They get interrupted and Juno and her dad leave. And then the rest of the film, I would say, is playing out the inevitable in so far as there's a baby to be had, and then that baby needs to be handed over. The remaining scenes are there to kind of obviously carry the story forward, but also to build on some of these characters. Allison Janney's character, Brenda, has already been introduced, and I already liked her at that point. Um, but there's a great scene where Juno goes to uh get an ultrasound and the ultrasound technician is a bit snippy with her or a bit kind of dismissive and um Allison Johnny's character just shreds her which is really really good. Yeah. So defensive. Do you know that actually was based on a conversation that Diablo Cody had with uh other uh young teenagers who'd had babies and that kind of treatment and that conversation was was based on on on reality. It's awful, isn't it? Yeah. Allison Johnny's character really does take her apart and it's it's really extraordinary to watch. We then get to see the first of a few meetings between Juno and Mark. Juno goes around to show Mark the ultrasound. Uh, and they do another one of these generational exchanges uh that I love. Um, and this fine. Like I don't really I don't think I got a sense at this point that there was like a chemistry building here. I don't think really. Oh my gosh. Maybe I'm just dumb. It's it's obvious from the moment he accosts her when she's coming out the bathroom and they look at the guitars immediately there's like some connection that they have that he doesn't have with Vanessa. Um and it just is built upon from there. Yeah. I think this is the skill that Diablo Cody adds to this is that in order for this story to play out and be interesting, one assumes that something is going to happen. I just didn't I didn't clock that it would be uh what does happen. So yeah, there's a couple more of these meetings. Um we get a few more scenes of you know Juno getting bigger um and uh you know trying to remain in high school. In my notes I I wrote that it's a refreshing take on the high school film. So as much as it's a story like a coming of age, it's also an a high school film. Um, and I you've got that kind of unlikely friendship between her and Leah. Like Leah's the cheerleader, Juno is the fringy person. You You'd never put them together. Um, and you'd never have put them together in the high school movies that I grew up with cuz I was watching this when I was like 19, 20. So when I the high school movies I was watching when I was like a younger teenager like more Juno's age or younger you know it was like the era of the plastics and the mean girls and the this and you had your posies whereas Juno is is not really like that as much. Yes, you've got like Bleecker. He's a runner but Bleecker is also kind of not like a jock is he? He's just someone who loves running and he's into running. Um, and you've got that kind of all mixing together in a more kind of realistic representation of a standard high school, senior school, whatever you want to call it. Um, and I really I really like that because stereotypically it wouldn't have been the nerdy, geeky, fringy girl that got pregnant. It would be the the cheerleader like shagging the high school jock on the ble. They call them the bleachers, right? That's right. Right. on the bleachers, Lucy. Yeah. Um Yeah. Um there's no clicks. There's no clicks in this film, is there? Really? No, it's just it just plays out just what it's like to be a teenager at school. Um, and just trying to find your way and like muddling through and having your first sexual encounters, having your your friends that are like your ride or dies, going to prom or not going to prom, who's going to be your date to prom, all of that kind of thing. Which of course, speaking of generational gaps, you probably didn't have a prom, did you, Tay? No. What is What is that? That's where um isn't that where the the one telekinetic girl in your class tries to murder everyone because she gets covered in pig blood. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, you get you see a bit more of that Juno getting bigger. Things are kind of plotting along. There's an amazing scene with Vanessa again in the shopping mall, which is uh lovely. uh where it's just another moment I think for Ghana to do her thing and just kind of like hammer home the fact that she really wants this kid um and build a rapport with uh Juno. It's really lovely to see. Yeah. Gets you on the heartstrings. Really does. Very well done. And made me a bit misty eyed quite a lot even watching it again this time. Probably more so this time. It also like does a nice job of reminding you that not everyone here is an adult. So Leah and Gino are at a shopping mall and they're just kind of being jerky teenagers just messing around like which is, you know, entirely plausible. Um, and that was Yeah, it was nice to kind of combine those two things to have something that progresses the story and builds a character but also reminds you that these people are are not fully adults yet. Really good. Yeah. something that um is around this time in the film where you've got Vanessa stocking up on baby things. So, she's buying bits and bobs for the baby. She's getting the house ready and then that's sort of juxtaposed with Brenda having to um customize Juno's jeans to make space for the growing baby because they can't actually afford to buy maternity clothes for her. And I think there is such an undercurrent of like the difference between the the two families. And it's it's really it's it's not just made reference to once or twice. It's kind of continually hammered home. I think Diablo Cody makes a point of it. I'm not really sure what the point is apart from maybe just Vanessa and Mark have got all the money in the world clearly. You know, I feel like maybe she's she's some sort of high achieving businesswoman. He whilst he looks like a layout is making music for ads. So he's probably earning pretty good money. Um but yet they can't have the one thing that they want and money can't buy that you know whereas Juno hasn't got really anything and she's got the one thing that they want. Um she's sort of vital for their happiness. Well certainly for Vanessa's happiness. Yeah. So yeah, we get a couple more moments. We get a moment with um Gino and Mark again uh watching a horror movie and just kind of chilling out. we get a bit of tension between Juno and uh Paulie. It's kind of teased out very early on that the idea to have sex was just Juno um and that she was bored and Paul's recollection of this is played out in a line. They're having an argument basically cuz he's kind of like very casually taking some girl who isn't Juno to the prom. So she's sort of very passive aggressively taking him to task for it. And uh he points out to Juno that she she dumped him and uh kind of hurt him. And there decision to have sex was not just something that she did because she was bored. Uh because and he says he says um no it couldn't have been bored because there was some really good stuff on TV at that time and the Blair Witch Project was coming to stars and so you know there was loads of things to do and blah and blah blah blah. He just kind of like tries to be as sassy as Juno in this kind of like this little moment and um it's he's it's pathetic, you know. It's really it's really great. It really kind of fills out his character at this point. There's there's this and another moment where they're in like a biology class and the couple that they have been paired with have a little row where there's a moment where Paulie is is asked something and he just he he he doesn't say anything. He just smiles and it's [ __ ] amazing. Like he he his restraint at that point, if he had a line to deliver at that point, his instincts about not delivering that line and just smiling are superb. Um really really great timing from from the boy Sarah. And then it feels like we're on the home straight with this film at this point. Things are getting more difficult with the pregnancy. Juno yet again goes over to Mark and Vanessa's and they're at that point now where you know Juno's asking is Vanessa here? Mark is saying no we're safe and it's like oh you know this is this is not going to go well. And inevitably, as kind of Lucy's kind of clocked ages ago, um Mark, it it seems improbable to assume that at some point Mark is going to like make a pass at Juno. I really didn't think that that would happen. I didn't think that any one of these kind of things going wrong would be that. I thought it would be her making a pass at him, actually, because of how assertive she is and how in control of pretty much everything she seems to be. Even going back to when she told her parents, she she knew that she couldn't tell her parents if she didn't have a plan or she felt that she couldn't. So, she felt like she had to be like, I know what I'm going to do. I'm going to I found I found a couple and I'm going to give the baby to them, you know. Um, so I actually thought that she would it would be her because she was putting on the lipstick. She was actively seeking him out. Um, yeah. So, it was weird when it then was him and I must have felt a bit uncomfortable at the time, but we're now watching this with like postmeto eyes and just being like older adults and yeah, for for sure me. Um, and so I don't know whether I just thought it was like maybe like more acceptable then, but now it's like totally disgusting. It made me feel like I wanted to peel my skin off. Like I just like I just can't even watch it. I was watching it with my boyfriend and he was just like like we were both and I was like he was like oh I forgot about this and I was like I don't remember this bit being that cringy and he was like no it it always has been. I was like maybe I just didn't register it then. I just I don't know. Um but yeah, it's super icky now. Yeah, agreed. Mark tells Juno that he's leaving Vanessa. Vanessa then promptly comes home and witnesses Juno's freak out. Um, they have a big kind of like moment where Mark kind of reveals to Vanessa that he's not ready and that they should have a break of some kind. Juno, you know, heads out, uh, is very upset. You kind of get a moment where she turns around and leave, you know, leaves a message at their door. You don't really find out what that is until later. It's a nice touch. And then you get a really lovely scene with JK Simmons. They have a moment where she's feeling very scared and he's just incredibly reassuring and it's just a really beautiful uh moment. you you touched on it earlier about how just cool they are with her pregnancy like let's we're just going to go with it and they just roll their sleeves up and just get on with it and you kind of get the feeling it's just like another thing that their family has dealt with and they just get on with it and they do it with with joy and grace and it's just it's just just so lovely. Yeah, it's great. He basically just says, you know, all you can do is hope is to try and find someone who just accepts you for who you are. And he knows that she's talking about love life and things, but he's sort of like, you're talking about your old dad, right? And uh it's just so it's just so lush. And that brings about a realization in Juno that she does in fact love poorly. They have a moment where she tells him how much she feels for him. uh and he kind of reciprocates and they are uh then I think sort of a quote unquote couple. He busts out a Scott Pilgrim line at that point. I noticed uh he when they kind of admit to each other that they love each other. I mean not really but it's like it is line for line and he says, "Oh, can we make out now?" Um which is uh Had Scott Pilgrim happened by No, no, no. It was several years later, but uh just I'm sure I wonder if it I'm pretty sure it's in the comic book, but I do wonder if like directors see these little lines from actors and go, "Oh, let's do that line you did from that film from four years ago." Uh that would be fun. One at one point some massive knobhead will uh spot that and then reference it in a podcast. Um and then it will be worth it. Um, so yeah, at this point we're the the the end of the film is crowning, I would say. Um, uh, we're not fully dilated yet, but um, the the end of the film is is on its way. Um, Juno's waters break. She is rushed to hospital in sort of typically sweet and quirky way uh, with the whole family and Leah. And then she kind of goes through the uh you know through the kind of motions of having the baby baby gets born. Baby t baby's taken away and given to Vanessa and there's a great exchange between Vanessa and um Brenda where Vanessa's holding the baby and says how do I look? Brenda says, "Uh, you look like a new mom, scared shitless." Which is, uh, really lovely. And this is where I kind of sour on the film a little bit, but there's nothing really left to do but drown in all of the horrific music that that they decided to soundtrack this film with, which I admit I did not mind at all. I loved a bit of Twe Indie um, at the time, but like in 2025, the tweet indie can go [ __ ] itself. It was absolutely awful. I was like really straining not to scratch my skin off. Um the amount of Molly Peach's Kima Dawson husky guitar in this. And if that wasn't enough, like the the last scene um is is uh Juno and Pauly just kind of jamming together and playing the exact freaking song that you've just listened to. Well, I I was singing along to it and realized that like it's like core memory unlocked that I I had the album. I had the Juno album, Juno soundtrack album. Yeah. And um I literally was just singing like word for word and it of course then transported me back to that time. But it is jarring now that like plinky plunky I'm sticking with you cuz I'm made out of glue. So it it is weird, right? Cuz there's a few great songs on the soundtrack for this film um that are used well. Um there's some kinks in there. There's some um Mont Hoople obviously they play that as a sort of one of their generational exchanges. Um, and then there's the Moldy Peaches. And then there's the more moldy peaches. And then there's even more moldy peaches. There's two Bell and Sebastian tracks. I think they were the ones that from their album at the time. There's some amazing songs on that album. I don't know why they couldn't have I I guess they weren't they weren't wet enough for to go on the film Juno. So, um, you know, they uh they went with some of the more kind of like jangly ones. Um, yeah, this is where 2025 me just completely derails this conversation. Um, I it I' I'd had a great time up at the up until this point. I think this, you know, this is still a great movie. It's still really well written and well acted. It just delivers except for it. I I could probably get along better with it if I just had it on mute with the subtitles going and then just just watch it with my memory of the dialogue rather than listen to the scenes. But you know that Elliot actually was instrumental in all of the music and actually said that Juno would listen to the Moldy Peaches, which is probably why there was so much of it. That's fine. I mean, it's slightly at odds with uh with the characters taste in um you know, the Stooges and Iggy Pop uh and the and the Runaways. Um but, you know, it's fine. Yeah, I think it's it's just very of its time. It goes well with the film. Um that kind of quirky sound. Yeah. You know, this is the danger of aging really. This this film is uh is untouchable. I think it's great. Um, just going back to your point about technology and when the film was set, uh, the only bit of technology that I saw was a Nintendo DS, uh, used by the girl in the abortion clinic. Um, and so that would put it at 2004. So, yeah, no phones. Um, and no social media uh, uh, to to speak of, although there was, you know, internet culture. This is the other thing I think that's going to be interesting in this podcast is talking about films that don't really have any pop culture momentum behind them beyond just like the nent internet. Um there's no I mean Facebook was a thing in 2007 but I don't think it was like widespread at that point and I don't think people had figured out how to use it for marketing. So Oh no. It was very much just a way of keeping in touch with people and posting photos of drunken nights out at university. Yep. Um, so yeah, that's Juno. Uh, highly recommend. Thanks for talking to me, Lucy, about Juno. I had a wizard time. You had a wizard time. Yeah, me too. It was great. Let's do it again, folks. Thank you for listening to uh this episode. Um, join us next week. We'll have something new from 2007, and it will be good. I promise.